These insane Democrat protesters are making people feel uncomfortable.

In my town, they didn't burn down Target yet, but they burned down a
beautiful, deluxe children's playground.

Did the toddlers in my rural upstate NY town have ties to Chauvin?

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On 03 Jun 2020 at 03:14a, Lee Lofaso pondered and said...

The wordings of the current oath of enlistment and oath for
commissioned officers are as follows:

Actually, the oath of office is slightly different:

"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter: So help me God."

(You can omit the "so help me god" part if you want.)

Whenever I did someone's reenlistment, I would ask them
ahead of time whether they wanted to swear or affirm and
whether they wanted the god part.

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On 04 Jun 2020 at 03:34a, Lee Lofaso pondered and said...

The wordings of the current oath of enlistment and oath for >LL>commissioned officers are as follows:

Actually, the oath of office is slightly different:

"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the >Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domest >that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this >obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; >that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on whi
I
am about to enter: So help me God."

(You can omit the "so help me god" part if you want.)

In both, the Constitution is listed first in their oath.

Yes. Because that is the most important thing. But if
you're going to say the oath of office says something, you
should be accurate.

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On 06 Jun 2020 at 03:47p, Lee Lofaso pondered and said...

Notice I did not mention anything about "oath of office" in my
original post. In my next post, to you, I quoted the oath of office
for the president, who never served in the military or swore any
oath of enlistment/oath for commissioned officers.

Stop doubling down when you're wrong: it's not a good look.

Just so we are both on the same page, here it is with url -

https://history.army.mil/html/faq/oaths.html

I already posted a URL. Do you just insist on being right?
Okay. You're right.

The UCMJ is quite clear on this: not only do all members
of the military have a right to ignore illegal orders, but
they have an obligation to actively resist those orders.

And yet, the joint chiefs of staff went along with their
president as he ordered active military to open fire on peaceful protesters (mostly women and children) on church grounds. The
soldiers did as they were told, using rubber bullets, pepper
spray, and tear gas to mow everybody down.

No, that was the National Guard and park police, plus
some kind of secret police formed from the Bureau of
Prisons. Those were not active duty troops.

When the president (as C-in-C) gives a soldier a direct order,
that soldier is expected to comply. The president is not going
to ask a soldier to go find his/her CO, as the president is at
that very moment his/her CO.

No. The "soldier" (note, I'm a Marine, not a soldier) is
only expected to comply if, and only if, the order is legal.
Yes, all members of the US military are given training on
legal and illegal orders. Yes, it is explained from entry
training onwards that illegal orders are to be actively
resisted.

Disobeying a direct order, especially during a time of war, can get
a soldier shot. Or stripped of rank and privilege. How many would be willing to take that chance?

Pretty much all. As I've said now, repeatedly, but for
some unfathomable reason you seem incapable of absorbing,
servicemembers are under no obligation to follow illegal
orders, and ignoring such an order is not considered
"disobeying a direct order."

I am sure you do know a number of officers you *think* would take exception to what has recently taken place with Trump ordering active military to open fire on peaceful protesters, with the full blessing
of his joint chiefs of staff. But how many of those you know actually would, when put to the test?

Given that I've seen them do it in combat, I'm willing to
bet pretty much all of them wouldn't have a problem telling
a 5x draft dodger who considered avoiding STDs in Studio 54
his "personal Vietnam" where to shove it.

Gen Milley shouted the president down in the Oval Office
the other day.

Talk is cheap. Especially when your own head is not on the line.
Active duty military, when ordered by their president to do his
bidding, will do as they are told. General Honor� was and is an
honorable man, who did stand up to power when his time of testing
came. Told the governor to take a flying hike, rather than have
his soldiers fire using live ammunation on kids stealing shoes
in department stores.

You speak with a confidence that is unwarranted given your
ignorance of the matter and overall lack of experience with
the subject.

You should stop.

And now, respectfully, you should stay in your lane
and shut the fuck up about the military.

Silence is complicity. Which is what made Hitler great.

I'm pretty sure I've been pretty vocal about what I think
about Trump. How dare you evoke Hitler when discussing the
US military.

You're the douche who posted that you had COVID-19 and then
tried to scurry behind a lame excuse of quoting someone.

I will not be silent, and neither should anybody else.

You have every right to say whatever you want. I have the
right to judge you as a sanctimonious ass who's ignorance and
arrogance and propensity for writing walls of unintelligible
text do more harm to the causes you claim to care about than
they do good.

We do not need another Hitler. Especially one with orange
hair. Even if he doesn't have a funny moustache. Hell,
his shade of orange skin is bad enough ...

Indeed. Perhaps you can get with the program and actually try
and help get rid of the scourge currently occupying the White
House? Posting uninformed claptrap about the military isn't
helping.

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On 09 Jun 2020 at 08:03a, Lee Lofaso pondered and said...

Milley was there, along with his dearly beloved president, supporting those National Guardsmen who followed the illegal orders given them.

You don't know that he loves your dear president.

I quoted the text of the oath of office for the president.

Why? Because you're such a big Trump supporter
you want everyone to know how you feel about him?

I also quoted the text of the oath of enlistment for those
who serve in the military. All the oaths call to defend the
Constitution of the United States.

Military officers aren't enlisted. You're so ignorant
you don't even know when you're wrong to accept correction.

Where do you get the bizarre idea that the military is there
to defend the president? Please tell. I'm all ears.

I'm not sure why you would ask that, since I never said
it was?

Who gave the orders for the National Guard to open fire on
peaceful protesters? Washington DC is not a state. No governors
there to give the orders. Who gave the orders? You should know,
being retired military.

Apparently, the DC police and your hero Trump.

Oh, and I never said I was retired. I am discharged.
You are so ignorant that you throw these terms around
without even knowing the first thing about what they
mean or how the military works. Typical right-wing
Trumper.

Hey asshole, point out where I ever said that anyone
in that crowd deserved what happened to them? Go ahead,
I'll wait.

General Milley said it was okay, by being there with Trump.

No no no. You said that _I_ was thought that what
happened to those protesters was deserved. Don't
deflect; tell me where _I_ said that. Be specific.

Defending Milley's actions is the same as saying the crowd deserved
what they got.

Milley wasn't even there when the crowd was attacked.
You're extrapolating without acknowledging any room
for possibly being wrong. That's typical Trump
supporter behavior.

The first cases of COVID-19 in the USA were in February.

Nope. They were far earlier.

Mark my words, nine months from February will come the first
coronababies of the year ...

So you're OK with everything the Trump administration
does, then? You're just peachy about the death of 100,000
Americans? You're fine with the way that people of color,
particularly African Americans, are disproportionately
affected by this pandemic? Meanwhile, you fully support
your president.

So are you going to show up at one of those reopening protests
without a mask and with a gun like the other right-wing nutjobs?
You clearly don't care about BLM and you clearly don't take
COVID-19 very seriously, so you'd probably fit right in.

Do realize none of those peaceful protesters have COVID-19. It is
only those from outside their communities who are infected. So why
wear a mask? Really no need. Unless one wanted to masquerade as a
member of the press.

Right-wing groups have stated publicly that they've
had members infiltrate protests while infected with
COVID-19 to deliberately spread the virus. I guess
you're ok with that, since your president told you
there was nothing to worry about. Do you plan on going
to a Trump rally without a mask now that they are being
restarted?

Download a digital copy. Plenty of free copies available.
Take as many as you want. Spread them around for others to read.
That will make you a true patriot. Of course, you might have to
explain it to them, and teach them what it all means ...

Maybe you and Ammon Bundy should get together and go
bowling. Then you can hit up a Trump rally together.

We joke about everything else. So why not COVID-19?
Can't leave anything out these days. Otherwise folks
will call you a bigot. Or a racist. Or both.

Yeah, not, you can leave some things out in the name
of decency. But if you're a Trump lover, you don't.
Seems pretty clear to me that you're a fan of your
Dear Leader.

Donald Trump has done the one thing no other president has
ever been able to do. He brought us all together.

So you're saying you support Trump.

That's right. Donald Trump is a uniter, not a divider.
Remember. You heard it here first.

At least we now know who you really support.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/05/28 (Windows/32)
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On 12 Jun 2020 at 03:36a, Lee Lofaso pondered and said...

And I answered that unequivocally: No. I am not, nor
was I ever, under any obligation to follow any illegal
order, no matter who issued it; I would not do so. You
evidently know me better than I do, though, and disagree
with me on what I would do and what I have seen other
military officers do.

Notice the president and his entourage waited until the protesters
had been cleared for them to make their appearance at the church.

Fact of the matter is you have no idea what you would do
in certain situations.

Actually, haven been in situations like that, I do.

If during a time of war your commanding officer gives you a
sidearm and tells you to take a prisoner to headquarters and
return in fifteen minutes, you would do it - even though it
would take you a full hour driving through heavy fighting in
enemy territory. You would do it just to save your own sorry
skin, knowing what your commanding officer would do to you
if you failed to follow that order.

Are you describing yourself? Because you sure as shit
aren't describing _me_. I've been in situations like
that and know full-well what I'd do.

Soldiers exist to follow orders. That's it. They are not there
to think. Only to do what they are told. Nothing more, nothing
less. The commander in chief is head honcho, and all his toy
soldiers and sailors and airmen are compelled to comply. Even
his spacemen, although not really sure what branch the space
force is supposed to be part of. In Robert Heinlein's world the
spacemen were Marines. But this is Trumpland ...

That's one of the most laughable things I've ever read.
That's empirically not true. Maybe for bootlickers like
you who want to follow Trump off an authoritarian cliff.

But you've also admitted to being a Trump supporter, so
this is unsurprising.

I said I wear a red hat and have a huge banner on my wall.
How does that make me a Trump supporter?

Your statements and actions do, symbols aside.

I am not retired, as I told you. That's a very specific
status; I served and left the service prior to retirement.
I am honorably discharged.

So is US Senator Tammy Duckworth. But at least you still have legs
to stand on. Unlike so many others, some who have lost far more.

What does that have to do with anything?

But since you brought here up.... Why don't you go tell
Sen Duckworth that she was there to only follow orders,
not to think, and that she'd commit war crimes if told
to do so by Donald Trump? She may have lost her legs to
the RPG round that hit her Blackhawk, but I'll bet she'd
tear you apart so fast you'd have no idea what hit you.

--Lee

The rest of your post was an incoherent wall of text.
Very well.

*PLoNk!*

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